Gran Alacant Forum
Gran Alacant Forum => General Discussions => Topic started by: John H on July 27, 2020, 08:26.
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We all have our views on whether people should be traveling to Spain and indeed other destinations at the moment and I'm sure that for those who have been making the journey or are planning to it has been a decision that many will that thought long and hard over.
From what I have read all members of this site have followed the law in making their journey and have followed the law whilst in GA.
With this in mind any future posts that are critical of those choosing to visit their homes will be removed.
We are getting to a position were folk wanting to share the their experiences of recent visits are feeling uncomfortable in doing so.
Regards all
John
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Well said John. 100% behind you.
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Whilst it is never my intention ( i cant speak for others) to make people uncomfortable, i think its important on a public forum to give a balance of opinions.Many members and visitors rely on forums to give opinion not found elsewhere, some advice is excellent some is not. Many people bigged up and promoted travelling to spain and poured scorn on the doubters, how many were swayed to travelling based on the optimism of others and now on reflection regret theyre decision. As a follower of facebook you will no doubt read the posts of sensible local people who paint a grim picture.
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https://www.rtve.es/noticias/20200727/cuantos-brotes-coronavirus-hay-espana/2018947.shtml?fbclid=IwAR22k14fiUbq5DfaFTf2GQ6ruBolUDx4mmkAeNOVFpwyiONR7PdQSzC6ZOs
Link from n332 Facebook which shows the number of cases in various areas. Very low in Alicante area showing it’s safer than most of UK but until FCO changes advice again it won’t make any difference.
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Whilst it is never my intention ( i cant speak for others) to make people uncomfortable, i think its important on a public forum to give a balance of opinions.Many members and visitors rely on forums to give opinion not found elsewhere, some advice is excellent some is not. Many people bigged up and promoted travelling to spain and poured scorn on the doubters, how many were swayed to travelling based on the optimism of others and now on reflection regret theyre decision. As a follower of facebook you will no doubt read the posts of sensible local people who paint a grim picture.
In that case you need to look elsewhere to find opinions and discussions of whether people should be allowed to travel or not Wilson because it won't be debated on here. People are travelling to Spain quite lawfully.
As I noted earlier we are getting to a position where folk wanting to share the their experiences of recent visits are feeling uncomfortable in doing so.
I am sure that members of the forum will find the experiences of other members visits to GA at the current time very useful in their decision making process of whether to travel to GA or not and for how long.
Regards all
John
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Opinions and discussions are perfectly acceptable, it’s the personal attacks that aren’t and it seems to be the same keyboard warriors every time.
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Well I braved it went to Spain last Sunday only because I had a water leak from my garden tap reported, which turned int a nightmare but that’s another story. Anyway travelling was fine Stansted was all socially distanced masks on lots of sanitizer . Sat in an empty 3 seat on Jet 2 ,very few on plane certainly not full .Alicante airport was fine visa check temp check etc , came back yesterday same in reverse no issues nothing to worry about visa form and temp check again . All the bars and restaurants I visited were fine it actually felt safer than the UK hated wearing a mask every time you went out but if that’s the rules then so be it Now doing my quarantine . Happy to do it .
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Opinions and discussions are perfectly acceptable, it’s the personal attacks that aren’t and it seems to be the same keyboard warriors every time.
Totally agree, there’s 2 in particular who seem to revel in attacking those who travel.
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You are quite right C&J - it does annoy me when the overall Spain number of circa 34 cases per 100,000 is cited as a reason to quarantine the country. Its somewhere in the region of 4.6 / 100,000 in the Santa Pola / Elche area and significantly less than the UK 14.9 / 100,000 if you count the whole of the Valencian region.
So, its safer to be in GA / Santa Pola than being (on average) in the UK.
UK Government just dont want people to travel - unless you are Grant Shapps of course who couriered out his family to Spain knowing that he was going to have to quarantine when he was leaving on Saturday - bizarre
https://www.rtve.es/noticias/20200727/cuantos-brotes-coronavirus-hay-espana/2018947.shtml?fbclid=IwAR22k14fiUbq5DfaFTf2GQ6ruBolUDx4mmkAeNOVFpwyiONR7PdQSzC6ZOs
Link from n332 Facebook which shows the number of cases in various areas. Very low in Alicante area showing it’s safer than most of UK but until FCO changes advice again it won’t make any difference.
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Flew back yesterday from a place which had 3 deaths on Saturday to one which had 150, and now having to quarantine for 2 weeks against a virus which is 3 times less likely to kill me than ordinary winter flu.
It's been an absolute and utter shambles from start to finish. The peak of this thing was 8th April and we're just starting to wear masks now?
They haven't a scooby doo.
Cheers
Davy !!!
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I fly out tomorrow (fingers crossed). Statistics say I'll be safer on the terrace in Spain than in the garden at home.
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Flew back yesterday from a place which had 3 deaths on Saturday to one which had 150, and now having to quarantine for 2 weeks against a virus which is 3 times less likely to kill me than ordinary winter flu.
It's been an absolute and utter shambles from start to finish. The peak of this thing was 8th April and we're just starting to wear masks now?
They haven't a scooby doo.
Cheers
Davy !!!
Davy. Where do you get the less likely to kill you figures from? Also who are they the ones that don't have a "scooby doo". All political parties in office for England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Island have agreed to current restrictions. The decision was not a political one but was the advice of the scientist who I expect and hope have more than a "scooby do" then you or I.
Derek
Ps. The death rate in the England between 2014 and 2018 resulting from Flu was between 11,875 and 28,330 per year surely the death rate resulting from Coronavirus is greater than this figure.
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I arrived back last Sunday the 19th having ridden through France to get to GA. It was noticeable how disciplined the public were throughout my trip on keeping the 2 metre distance and the wearing of Face Masks. I have no signs of having caught the virus yet. It is a personal choice and everyone needs to mitigate the risks and keep the virus at bay. Would I go against the current Government advice possible not purely as my insurance would not cover me. If I was single then yes but I have to consider my family and the trouble they would have if I was taken ill whilst in Spain.
Derek
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Derek,
The office for national statistics is now stating that total deaths for 2020 are below the average for the last 5 years. The 3 times less likely figure ….from the world health organisation, is actually for everyone. I personally have next to zero chance of dying from COVID-19.
The UK government deciding to advise against all travel to all parts of Spain is, in my opinion, a knee jerk reaction, when both spikes occurred in localised areas.
Add the fact that they did the square root of Jack when spikes appeared in Leicester, Bradford etc and the whole thing smacks of an agenda that we’re not party to.
Scientists are fabulous at giving advice, and governments are wonderful at cherry picking the ones they like. You only have to look at the climate change issue and the fact that over 75,000 ‘scientists’ voted against the Kyoto protocol to realise that. They were ignored!
Having said all that, my opinion hasn’t changed from day 1.
There’s a virus out there. There’s no cure. We’ve all had it or we’re all gonna get it. We need to live with it.
This is the biggest over reaction in the history of mankind.
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I don't always believe what I read so I checked out the source of your post.
Deaths from all causes this year to date 362,259
Average over the past 5 years (same period) 309,081
Therefore you have a 17.20% more chance of dying this year than the average of the past 5 years. It would be interesting to understand how you have calculated that the office of national statistics give you a different take on what is presented. Maybe I am looking at it wrong.
See here
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales
PS; Can history be rewritten I wonder. Kyoto Protoco was agreed by 192 countries who signed and ratified it. Only three countries did not sign up to it being Afghanistan, Sudan and the USA.
It is not true there is no cure for people do recover from it. It is not correct that everyone will contract the Coronavirus disease but it is true that there is a risk of death resulting from catching the virus and that is exactly why we all need to be very careful not only for our own health but even if someone catches the virus but does not suffer from any symptoms they can still pass it on to others whom may succumb to it. Vaccines are being developed which hopefully will allow life to return to normal but until then we all need to be careful for the good of everyone. I saw a few hard nut Brits that were featured on a youtube video taken in Benidorm. One also made the comparison to normal flu. I am sure the virus does not concern itself with how tough the victim is in its choice to whom to infect next.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkH-5bUeObc
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Davy
This is ONS data produced in the Economist - a fairly reliable source I think you will agree
There has been a significnat and clear number of excess deaths in the UK and every city where data is available.
"excess deaths" are those that have deviated from the prior rolling 5 year average
I am suprised that you have info saying the the ONS is now stating that the total deaths for 2020 is lower than the last 5 years - have you got the source for that info ?
Snapshot of the data as it is no is in the picture below
Link to source
https://ourworldindata.org/excess-mortality-covid
There will be a vaccine for sure - lots of promising trials underway
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You beat me to it
I don't always believe what I read so I checked out the source of your post.
Deaths from all causes this year to date 362,259
Average over the past 5 years (same period) 309,081
Therefore you have a 17.20% more chance of dying this year than the average of the past 5 years. It would be interesting to understand how you have calculated that the office of national statistics give you a different take on what is presented. Maybe I am looking at it wrong.
See here
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales
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Congratulations on ignoring what I wrote and commenting on what you think I wrote.
I never claimed the Kyoto Protocol wasn’t ratified, and people recovering from what is basically a flu does not mean there is a cure.
Carry on eating what you’re fed though. I’m sure it works for you.
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and the less deaths see here;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jq3H1QZlct0
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It will be interesting to see if and when the vaccine is rolled out in the uk whether all the naysayers and its just like a bad cold gang will demand they be first in the queue. Hopefully they will stick to their thoughts and beliefs.
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Non of them will Wilson, they all think Bill Gates is putting microchips in them 😉
Regards all
John
Edited to correct spelling mistake, thanks Derek
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No doubt with a good helping of onion gravy on those micro chips.
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Hi
I was chosen randomly!!to take a COVID 19 swab test, this is what happens, they send you a test kit in the post , you then book a courier to collect, they give you a day, mine was Sunday 26 July, I done the test early Sunday morning it was collected Sunday afternoon, I have received a result today 29 July. , so from taking the test to receiving the results is less than 3 days. !!!
I’m clad to say it was negative
So why don’t everybody get tested in different areas ie polling stations , they have already got everyones details that way surely we would know exactly where and who has it is and contain it.
Or am I missing something ????
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The problem is the number of false negative tests, even from swabs taken by professionals trained in how to take the sample.
The figure appears to show that c.30% of those testing negative are in fact positive.....hence the reason why despite a negative test result you have to quarantine for two weeks.
The worry is that folk, like yourself who show as negative, will ignore quaratining and spread the virus unknowingly.
Regards all
John
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I know what you mean but since I took the test on Sunday, I’ve been to work and could have caught it , so the testing is a waste of time if it’s not done in bulk !! Who knows what the solution is ???
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Looking at the figures it would appear that Jacinda Ardern the PM of New Zealand has the answer, she's been tough and still is, but the results are incredible, only 22 deaths.
Regards all
John
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I've been gobsmacked by the amount of people who believe that if you eventually get a vaccine jab you will get a chip inserted into, it makes me despair. I've always been a firm believer in vaccination having had a friend at school catch Polio, he was off for a year and ended up with a withered arm and leg.
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I’m surprised at the number who don’t want to be vaccinated. I still believe it should be compulsory, with consequences if you refuse to have it . In these tough times I would even agree with forcibly giving it if it was the only option .
Idont see how a vaccine can be effective if 10% don’t have it , besides there don’t seen any other options months of lockdown etc have only moved us further down the road not killed it
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Spurs, that's what lockdown has done, moved it further down the road, without the vaccine the virus will run its course. I'm going to have the vaccine if it's offered, can't see it being forced on people though, vaccination has been the biggest benefit to mankind, I was reading about Joaquin Rodriguez recently the great Spanish composer, blind from the age of three from Diphtheria. Ben Goldacre's " Bad Science" has an excellent chapter on vaccination, I've often thought this book should be part of schools curriculum.
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I dont think I would have the vaccine, No one knows the side affects and a new strain could already be out there anyway. Maybe the elderly should have it, much like the flu jab. I would worry if my children had it as well. They are all fit and healthy. Just my opinion
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I've never had a flu jab but I think I would have a covid one, although that may sound a bit irrational covid seems to be much more virulent.
I'm by no means an expert but some viruses like flu mutate so a jab has to be seasonal to protect against the latest strain; perhaps covid will be similar.
Other vaccinations against polio, measles, diphtheria etc i think should have some element of compulsion as they can lead to the complete eradication of the illness, smallpox is an example. What that compulsion would be I don't know but the fallout from Andrew Wakefields flawed study of the MMR jab leading to autism has led to a resurgence of measles across the world when apart from a few countries it had been eradicated.
Drifting off the thread a bit I suppose but an interesting topic.
Dave
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I flew into Alicante Wednesday morning. Plane was 10% full at the most. I had 24 seats to myself. Cabin stewardess told me there had been mass cancellations due to having to quarantine. Went through passports, locator form and temperature check without any problems.
I phoned for the minibus to take me to the car and the driver said only one person/ family allowed in the minibus at one time so the other family who had just turned up without phoning had to wait for the bus to return.
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These updates from those visiting are very useful, please let us know know what it’s like in area, restaurants, beaches etc
We’re hoping to go out late September depending on restrictions etc
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These updates from those visiting are very useful, please let us know know what it’s like in area, restaurants, beaches etc
We’re hoping to go out late September depending on restrictions etc
Thank you for that comment, that's exactly why I stopped the posts criticising those who are traveling to GA or contemplating doing so.
Regards all
John
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These updates from those visiting are very useful, please let us know know what it’s like in area, restaurants, beaches etc
We’re hoping to go out late September depending on restrictions etc
Restaurants, bars etc all open. Quieter than normal obviously but all social distancing measures in place, hand gel freely available in all establishments at the entrance. Masks to be worn at all times, apart from when eating or drinking. Beaches are fine too, we have been several times and again all social distancing measures are being adhered to. Policia Local on dune buggies ensuring the beaches are safe. It's absolutely fine and everyone we have spoken to feels very safe. So have a great time in September!
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I noticed that restriction (on the transfer bus) on Saturday when I came back to the UK - just one person or family in the bus at any one time. As I am with EcoParking (strongly recommend them on basis of price and convienience) the bus turnaround was less thna 10 mins as its so close to the terminal
Have a great trip B&W, it was pretty quiet as when we over there - some of it at the same time as your first trip - I do feel sorry for the bars who were already really struggling before this latest ruling. I dont think they will all make it through sadly
I flew into Alicante Wednesday morning. Plane was 10% full at the most. I had 24 seats to myself. Cabin stewardess told me there had been mass cancellations due to having to quarantine. Went through passports, locator form and temperature check without any problems.
I phoned for the minibus to take me to the car and the driver said only one person/ family allowed in the minibus at one time so the other family who had just turned up without phoning had to wait for the bus to return.
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Another interesting thing is when I took my car for its itv today they don't test the seat belts anymore. Presumably so they don't have to enter the car when you're sitting in it. Unfortunately I didn't understand the brake test instructions so the girl kicked me out (big signs saying under no circumstances are you to get out of your car), jumped in and did that bit herself.
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When you book the itv the instructions are to fasten all seat belts in their holders so they dont need to go in the car. As for the brake test you have to apply the brakes slowly or they lock and the rollers kick you out. I dont think the test is as strict due to corvid restrictions be that good or bad. The advantages of corvid. When applying for residencia/changing water bill/driving licence etc the staff on the front line seem more helpful or is it that they just want you out.
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Hi
We have booked flights to come out on the 18th August for 3 week, but keep reading the travel insurance will not be valid, dos anyone know if the National insurance and (E111) is still valid during the current situation,
Thanks in advance.
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Hi Steve
Yes your EHIC is still valid for medical treatment up to 31st December 2020. It does not however cover you for loss, theft, repatriation etc.
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In a country of 66 million people, 5 died in uk hospitals yesterday “with” COVID.
The nhs never was and certainly isn’t now “overrun”.
Time to end this farce now!
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It will Steve, although it is no substitute for travel insurance in my book.
I know two people who have had to be brought back to the UK from Spain following illness who did'nt have travel insurance, one in an air ambulance and another accompanied by a Doctor, the costs were astronomical.
Worth taking a look at https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/travel/free-ehic-card/
Regards all
John
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In a country of 66 million people, 5 died in uk hospitals yesterday “with” COVID.
The nhs never was and certainly isn’t now “overrun”.
Time to end this farce now!
I don't know where you are getting your figures from, 74 folk in the UK lost their lives in one day on the latest reported figures.
My cousin, a recently retired nurse with years of NHS experience, went back to work for the NHS in a fairly average teaching hospital when they put the call out....at the peak she was helping deal with on average 12 ambulances an hour arriving with patients displaying Covid symptons....
Regards all
John
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The peak was April 8th.
It’s August and we’re hearing more and more about the numbers of people dying “with COVID” rather than “from Covid”.
Everyone who dies is getting tested and if Covid antibodies are found it goes down as a Covid death. The recovery rate is 99.97%.
We’re being played.
Open the pubs!
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Covid deaths for the month of July:
England - 2230
Wales - 46
Scotland - 6
N. Ireland - 5
(per BBC News)
Let´s all go down the pub!
Bert
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dleafy, we dont use language like that on here or pass comments to other members as you have.
I have removed your post.
Regards all
John
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Caught Covid in March.... recovered in April..... got run over by a bus in July...... COVID-19 death.
Yeah right!
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Yet misinformation and scaremongering is fine John?
837 members and the same half a dozen posters???
Enjoy your echo chamber.
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I think if everyone just posts what it’s like to travel and in GA & area that would be great. The posts on deaths & against travel just start arguments and most of us are just interested in what it’s like in Spain.
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Yet misinformation and scaremongering is fine John?
837 members and the same half a dozen posters???
Enjoy your echo chamber.
dleafy, express you point without resorting to offensive language and no one will stop you. People will look at information from various sources and and analyse it as they see fit.
You had your figure of, I quote directly from your post; "5 died in uk hospitals yesterday “with” COVID".
The only figure I could see for yesterday was as the screen shot I posted from figures supplied by the UK Government, what was the source of your claim?
To me the only person spreading misinformation was yourself once again.
Regards all
John
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5 hospital deaths in England.
Stop spreading false information!!!!!
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Two points I have to make. Totally agree that opinions should be expressed with respect to others at all times and others are entitled to hold a different view, this in fact that makes forums like this fun. As for members of this forum not being interested in the situation in Spain I for one (and I expect most others) are certainly interested.
Usually in life insults start to come when someone's view has its reliance on a weak base.
Derek
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Uk government last week... Leicester... close everything.... shut the bars... close the restaurants... Covid is out of control.
Uk government this week re: Leicester.... pubs and restaurants can open.... everything is fine.
The media is the virus!
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Thread closed.