Brexit, that horrible word

[Tony Gillam]

As Spurs said, it's the most important vote we will ever make. My big concern is the resistance to reform by the Eurocrats. The MEP on BBCQT last night spoke most eloquently on the matter. The push for expansion encompassing countries that aren't even geographically in Europe suggests to me that personal fiefdoms are the more important than reform.

I do share John Hannon's concerns about jobs but my guess is that in the event of Brexit we will see the EU implode within a few years. There would then be an opportunity to build a decent common market. At the moment we are faced with an inexorable march to a federalist USofE and I'm not sure how many members really want that.

[kevinb]

My fears as well Tony, the EU is never going to be reformed in its current state, if we leave the Dutch will follow and the EU will disintegrate, only then with member states the wiser can a change be made . The problem is we only have one chance to exit , to me its the safest action voting out. Think it will be quite refreshing for the UK if we leave, suspect we will be looked up to by other members.

[Spurs]

At last some politicians standing up and starting to give "facts". Now at least we are starting to be able to make a sensible decision..

I still think the data had been put out far to late but there is a shed load of facts and details come out this weekend and today ..

Now we have to decide interesting its on a knife edge at the moment

[Corporal Jones]

I was listening to Georges facts earlier today he must have been liasing with mystic meg to predict finances for future decades, he normally struggles with an annual budget forecast.

[Spurs]

Interesting day today the out campaign get to give their views today hope the can give better facts than George gave yesterday 15 year predictions we can't get 15 months right!!!
Surprising news on sky this morning that there are growing claims in France for a referendum on leaving as well

[Tony Gillam]

That'll get the tractors blockading the Champs Elysee.

[mike and judith]

Talking personalities, Victor, if Michael Give says leave, I can think of no bigger incentive to vote to stay in.  The man proved incompetent in not one, but two offices!

[kevinb]

Don't agree about Gove, he was right on education.

[Corporal Jones]

Heard today that the farmers want to stay in the EU probably nothing to do with the millions some of them receive annually
in subsidy  for growing nothing on their land, hmmmmmmm

[kevinb]

Right there Victor .

[kevinb]

I found this about TTIP today, its quite disturbing.
We have been asked about TTIP and what it is  -

So what is TTIP and why it is very bad for the UK and the NHS.

Here are 12 Facts about TTIP that may help you.

1) Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership.
2) Designed to open Americas Trade and Services to the EU.
3) A free trade agreement.
4) Currently being negotiated in secret between the EU Commission and the US.
5)The most common argument put to the public is that, by removing the restrictions on trade it will  make it easier for private companies to trade, FTAs will increase economic growth and jobs.

BUT -
6) The FTA will give transnational corporations the right to enter the UK market and operate without limits on their activities and
encourage privatisation of the public sector.

7) The FTA  is concerned with removing non-trade barriers (such as regulations or standards – often governing safety) or ‘harmonising’ these so that each party to the treaty accepts the standards of the other, or sees their standards as equivalent (‘mutual recognition’). In many instances this means that accepting the regulatory standards of other countries could undermine many of our hard-won social, health and environmental regulations, and prevent new regulations where these interfere with transnationals’ profits.

The FTA includes what is known as an 'investor-state dispute settlement' (ISDS),This means that transnational corporations have the unique right to use an international tribunal of three corporate lawyers to directly sue the UK government if it introduces any new regulation that might, even unintentionally, damage the corporation’s investment, including its expected future profits. As a result of protest against TTIP, its inclusion of ISDS, ISDS in TTIP is currently under review and may involve a slightly different process known as ‘Investment Court System’

9) ISDS also severely limits the ability of governments to move public services out of markets in which investors have substantial interests. (NHS for example).

10) ISDS gives special privileges to foreign investors as it is not a course of action available to domestic companies or EU citizens. Nor can the UK government use ISDS to sue a transnational corporation. Curiously, as the EU trade commissioner has admitted, there is no direct relationship between the inclusion of ISDS in a FTA and increased foreign investment, prompting questions about why governments agree to offer foreign investors a special court.

11) An FTA may require that a Regulatory Cooperation Council is set up to ensure future coherence between the regulations of the different countries involved, giving new powers to corporations to re-negotiate existing regulations or to challenge proposed legislation (even prior to this coming before Parliament), if this conflicts with their corporate interests.
Regulatory cooperation between the EU and US is not new: what is new is the level of ambition for this in agreements like TTIP.

12) ‘Regulatory cooperation’ allows negotiators to dismantle regulation behind closed doors even after a FTA has been agreed and some see that this facility is even more advantageous to transnational corporations than ISDS. What’s more, the prospect that regulatory cooperation might be included in TTIP already seems to deter the EU from regulating. For example, apparently in response to threats from the US about the future of TTIP, the EU has repealed a ban on the treatment of beef with lactic acid and abandoned plans to ban certain pesticides associated with cancer and infertility.

So there you have it.

[kevinb]

Hi Victor. We are 4.2b down the hill, reckon you are right, lack of action by council, don't think it matters where you go in Spain, roaches are everywhere, I remember reading the other year that the popular Spanish island resorts were particularly bad.Don't suppose they put that in the brochures.

[kevinb]

Sod it put it in wrong subject, getting feeble minded.

[mike and judith]

Euro politicians & cockroaches.  -   I can see a link!!!!!

[Tony Gillam]

On the face of it, it does look like another reason for "Out". Although given the proposed expansion of the EU and ,almost certain, influx of EU migrants from Turkey and elsewhere, we might need US healthcare companies to cope with demand.